photographers are not artists and will never be
cope, sneethe, etc I don't care
pick up a pencil

>>7163533
Copying photographs is the lowest form of art so yeah

>AI does it
>nothing happens
humiliation ritual

>>7163545
i think doing it is fine if you have construction skills and can make something on your own, unlike those hyperrealistfags that work like printers that boomers like to post on facebook

>paint a photograph
>get sued

>photograph a painting
>post it on your social media account
>nothing????

>>7163533
>because without knowing that I can own what I create & make a living off it - I could never have chose this path for my life.
hmm. then you don't enjoy the process and don't do it for your soul. you were just doing it for money.
she's not an artist, medium irrelevant.

>>7163570
he used it in contest and won something

>>7163571
If it was in consent why was he sued?

>>7163574
where do you see consent from the photographer? maybe you don't know the word?

>>7163533
This is fair, copyright laws must become a lot harsher, it’s the only way for us artists to survive without having to find a real job. Of course this must be true only if it benefits me personally, for example if doujinshi became illegal I would be against it.

>>7163577
you're the one that brought up consent, the photographer claims consent from the artist was needed, are you just plain fucking retarded?

>>7163568
Wagecucks be like:
>NOOOO YOU MUST WORK IN THE CAGIE TOO!! YOU CANT JUST LIVE OFF DRAWING ALL DAY!!!

>>7163568
I will never understand why /ic/ romanticizes being a starving artist. You can enjoy the process and make money the two aren't mutually exclusive

>>7163645
It's either non-artist or just retarded hobbyist.

>>7163533
Don't worry I'm sure the new multi million dollar AI copyright algorithms the corpos are investing in to monitor the internet ecosystem will streamline the process of litigation and take downs so (you) can focus on more productive things in life.

>>7163645
it's always bitter wagies or tech niggers who think maintaining Goldstein's network infrastructure makes them essential workers lmao

>>7163584
>>7163571
look retard, contest is not consent, you brain rot fucking nigger cuck.

>>7163663
>I'm sure the new multi million dollar AI
The bit at the end of OP's image seems to be a shot at AI, at least to me anyway.

>>7163805
It's a step forward, I guess. But with how long the legal process took here I bet it's going to be just as tedious whenever big AI copyright cases eventually do pop up

>>7163533
Based, retarded reference fags are fucking cancer. At least add your own twist to it, dumb fuck, not just fucking copy it 1:1

But if he were to paint that bitch in the exact same pose from life, he would be fine.

yea, referencing stuff in a non transformative way should only be done for practice

>>7163805
>>7163815
This has always applied to AI, but the problem is AI produces unique results.

>>7163955
>the problem
not a problem at all, its a good thing actually

>>7163533
realism copy "artists" are fucking hacks. Only normies eat up their uninspired garbage. They should be sued more often, maybe it'll finally kill this trend

>>7163581
>doujinshi became illegal
Do you mean doujinshi fan work of another IP not self-public original comic?
if the original author doesn't want it then it is already illegal.

>>7163533
>chinks copies everything
>"haha lol just chyna things"
>someone else copies chinks
>"Lawyer up white man"
Fucking chinks.

>>7163568
she was doing fashion photography, of course it was for money.
imo the issue was asian narcissism. the painting being such a copy was lame

>>7163533
aesthetic photo of an Asian woman in aggressive makeup, bare shoulders, from behind, looking back

>>7163815
>Like no, it was never ok to use works without consent, period.
It's always good when it benefits me, otherwise it's bad.
That photo, very original. Absolutely based on nothing. Made absolutely whole-cloth. A work of pure one-in-a-millennium genius.

>>7164428
>aggressive
most likely a noise token, if anything it probably contributed something to her face. you could take it out.

>>7163533
It is, and I'm glad we now have a precedent like this.

reminder that this board hosts 1.1TB of stolen content for education. You can't support that and support overreaching copyright when it potentially hurts your income.

Based photographers btfoing imaginationlets/priced out plebs who cannot afford models once again.

>>7167629
>You can't support that and support overreaching copyright when it potentially hurts your income.
I can and do.

>>7167629
>1.1TB of stolen content
>he pretends like that's a lot
lol

>>7163533
Ooooh I remember that hack loser Jeff Dieschburg, a real piece of shit who thinks it's okay to steal. Screw that guy.

>>7163645
those are the people who don't actually draw

>>7163545
reason why teachers in the good times always insisted on making your own homework and not stealing from others, but the people are retarded and lazy with no love for what they do, and prefer shortcuts through theft.

>>7163533
>hire a pretty model
>hire a makeup artist
>hire a fashion designer
>hire a hair artist
>setup the most basic of lighting
>take credit for all of it.

>>7163568
If I get paid for it as if it were a job, I can do it all day long.

Fuck photographers, but the logic itself applies. The renaissance greats were paid for their work, had comissions and they would not have been able to invest as much time into art if it weren't for paying patrons

>>7163904
I use a lot of photo reference for my work. First I'll make a rough sketch of what I want and then I search for all the reference I'll need for it. I'll try to find reference for the hair, different parts of the face, something close to the pose, different references for lighting, reference for anatomy, reference for clothing and lighting, reference for props like flowers and stuff. I can use over 20 photos for a single painting.

I just combine it all in my head and use it to make a final painting. There are ways to use other peoples photos as reference without copying directly. Usually when I'm done with a piece you could never tell what photos I actually used I change them so much.

>>7163955
>AI produces unique results.
fucking kek. There are hundreds of examples of AI just copying someone else's painting by barely changing anything because it didn't have enough data in the model to create something on it's own. It's just proof that AI steals from actual artist and wouldn't work if they didn't.

>>7163533
The painting is objectively superior to the photograph and therefore he should win

>>7163533
Artist? He's a photographer and he thinks he is an artist? Not only that, but he says he "Creates" and lives off from that?

Fuck that. Why are people like that allowed to live? He should be picking rice in a field, the fucker does jackshit and now has put an innocent man in prison, the guy probably had other activities other than painting that now he can't do. Artists are scum.

Reminds me I went to a photography studio the other day to get a portrait for a job application. The dumbfuck photographer told me to sit there and took the picture as if it were some passport shit. Then I told him to retake it, i told him the specifications and the idiot got angry and didn't want to refund, because he saw himself as an "artist" and couldn't be wrong. Fuck him. Hate people like that are allowed to exist under this shitty capitalism.

You shouldn't be able to copyright a photo that doesn't make any sense. You didn't make shit

>>7163541
Photography and art are two distinct disciplines, with some overlap, but photography still requires some amount of skills. An extreme example are wild-life photographers who spend many hours outside at once, still and silent.

>>7163546
The issue I guess is it's literally the same pic, just painted. AI is really no different than copying a artists style and mixing it with you're own. Like all the sakimi copycats and all that

>>7164229
i think there's difference between two, the internet hyper realists that just autistically print out the image and those who can actually construct the image and understand the way it works

>>7168932
That’s not really true. A lot of non-photographers don’t realize how much professionals design the lighting, pick costumes, perspective, travel, make camera/lens choices, etc. Then there’s photo editing which has been done since the 19th century. It's part of why drawing copies of photographs is seen as unskilled. Because the photographer has made all of the artistic decisions already.

>>7163533
> defending or pretending to defend deviantart tier plagiarism
And this is how you know /ic/ has turned to trash

>>7167929
The key word is "hire". He paid a commission for their services, so yes, he gets credit for the photograph.

>>7171083
I should "hire' a bunch of koreans to make a bunch of paintings for me and then just say I made them all.


My art

Anonymous

>>7164095
I would recommend learning how to draw. Hope this helps.

>>7164095
You probably don't need your own thread. Go to the Beg/Int Thread:
>>7160834

But I guess while you're here let's have at it then.

The Master Shake sketch/doodle is a doodle? I'm not sure exactly what you want someone to really critique about it? If we're going by technical standards, the lineart is rough and messy. It lacks confidence in each brush strokes so it feels more like a doodle or sketch. The lack of pressure sensitivity/opacity hurts it as well as there isn't much line weight going on. Coloring-wise, none of the colors are within the borders of the lineart. On a structural level, it's hard to make out any real forms due to the lack of confident lines but what forms are there are rough.

Master Shake's face has a very warped structure to it where none of the proportions lineup. I get that this is meant to be a stylized cartoon version of a cartoon but the lack of proper facial proportions, steady forms or confident lineart hurts the artwork overall. It feels like a doodle done within 10 minutes and is lacking any structure to give it any true appeal to it.

>>7164097
This is much better. The cleaner lineart gives the impression that you spent more time on this. However, the forms here are still not very well structured. There's some line weight in areas but it doesn't really feel consistent. For example, the arm holding the skull could have thicker lines below it to give a better impression of shadows. Same thing with the cape. Anything that should be casting heavy shadows should be thicker and anything getting caught with light should have thinner lines.

The face is pretty rough. The left eye is too widely stretched and the nose/mouth feels like it's pushed too far to the right or "in". There needs to be structure applied to the face. You need to nail construction or forms before putting down any lineart, it'll make things much easier.

>>7164098
Again, the sketch is cool but the lines are scratchy and not confident.

>>7164127
>>7164095

And so there's something beyond just me adding some critique, I took your design and drew it. Drawing a Sol Badguy Master Shake wasn't on my bingo card for shit I was going to draw tonight, so I appreciate it.

>>7164152
Whoops, I forgot to color in the ear piercings.

>>7164152
nta how did you get this good, explain in detail or I'll murder your bussy (with rizz)

>>7164159
In detail?

Well, let's see. I was drawing at an early age to impress friends with silly comics. Eventually, I wanted to draw characters but I found that most of my drawings had a bit of a Jhonen Vasquez influence to them -- i.e lots of sharp angles.

Add in some anime influences to that and I started to learn how to incorporate more rounder shapes in conjunction with those sharp angles. The contrast of round shapes and sharp flat edges is something that looks visually appealing to me, so often my artwork will have sharp triangle like angles mixed with contours. Especially clothing. I loved Valve/TF2 when I got older and incorporated their use of J.C Leyendecker triangular shapes for clothing folds.

Scared of full body drawings, I focused on drawing 3/4th's view portraits. Especially for D&D characters in my friend's games. Doing 3/4ths view portraits over and over has gotten the basic proportions and facial shapes you might see on a face imprinted in my mind. So my visual library with faces is big enough for me recognize different shapes and patterns against the planes of the face to create unique faces or "archetype" faces. For example, high sharp edge cheek bones for sinister or pompous characters.

Only recently have I tried applying this same sort of learning to bodies and anatomy. Still learning, but this is pretty much the key to drawing:

You draw enough of something that you naturally get it imprinted into your head. The visual shapes and edges act like notes on a piano that you can pluck and play to make some type of melody. Sometimes the melodies are quite awful but sometimes they can be appealing or interesting.

>>7164159
by not being a gen alpha faggot fr, lil bro really though he cooked. Its on sight lil bro fr, its giving toxic??

>>7164211
thank you for the detailed (you), your bussy is safe....for now

>>7164127
>It feels like a doodle done within 10 minutes
???
That's a decent amount of time to spend on a drawing

>>7164095
Try looking up references and draw from life/ also try to imagine the style or look that you think is ideal and aim to get closer to that after mastering the basics.

Realize the truth anon, your ideal is the milkshake from aquateenhungerforce

>>7164095
Words of wisdom:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Up_<wbr>KMtm0Gn0

>>7164980
come and say it to my face then
https://twitter.com/hexxewyrm

>>7165002
You’re a twitter faggot, do you really need to whore yourself on two websites? Not getting enough validation over there? Go back, cunt

master shake is a fat jewish guy, everyone knows this

>>7164155
I thought this was another one of OPs drawings, it's still shit

>>7165742
Sounds like you're just stuck in the drizzle, anon.

>>7164095
Jesus. Get off twitter and go read an art book

>>7164095
You have to be 18 or older to post here

How old are you anon? Genuine question. It'll change what I say next and how much advice I'm going to give

>>7164095
Try refining your artistic eye.

>>7164095
at least I knew it was shake the moment I saw him

>>7164152
Why would you draw such an ugly thing? You have greater technical skill than op but fucking somehow less appeal

>>7168390
Because sometimes it's super fun to draw the dirtiest, ugliest shit sometimes.


>>7164122
ive been unemplyed for six months and i start a new job next week so im trying to squeeze in as much as possible before i just back to the suit and tie and buying anime statues

>>7164122
usually once a week if I'm busy or sick, or every other day plus other projects.

>>7164122
I force myself to draw 20 minutes every day.

>>7164122
Not much. Mostly I just lay around in bed all day.

>>7164122
usually a few hours a day (or every other day at minimum)

>>7164122
2347 hours logged since i started 1669 days ago as a hobby. thats an average of 1 hr 24 mins per day.

>>7164122
everyday. sometimes for 1 hour. sometimes for 6 hours. sometimes for 30 minutes. but every day. it all adds up no matter how small.

>>7164122
I haven't drawn for 3 months. I'm a dead inside virgin salary man and I just doodle schizo doodles in a piece of paper all day. Doodles without any thought, just repeating lines and pattenrs and random hatches and crosshatches and perspective and shading, sometimes words and letters are popping up that I have not consciously thought of. Last 3, realistically, last 6 months I'm depressed as fuck, it's so fucking over.

>>7164122
1-2h daily. Trying to ramp up slowly to not burn myself out.

>>7164122
Minimum 8hrs a day on week days as it's my job. On weekend at least 15 mins, i try not to ever have a day where i draw nothing

>draw every day for a month
>feels good
>stop for 2 days
>can't start up again

>>7164413
>>can't start up again
imagine that part of your brain as pic related
you really wanna let that guy make your life decisions?

>>7164413
This is why I try to draw even just a bit every single day. once you take a break, every single day that goes by makes it harder to return.

>>7164426
I'm waiting for the right mood, I'm not drawing uninspired scribbles because I only draw good when I really want to draw.

>>7164432
That's the quintessential ngmi attitude

I started keeping track on February 6th and i'm now at 408 hours so that's about 4 hours a day. This week i've drawn around 7 hours a day though.

>>7164122
Fuck drawing. I quit that shit. Now I just play videogames all day

>>7164438
when I want to draw I draw for 8 hours.

>>7164432
>I'm waiting for the right mood
ngmi

>>7164122
Every day after work for about 4 weeks now. Exceptions are emergencies or having to help my parents with shit afterwork
Before, prolly 2 times per week
Im not counting qwk doodles

>>7164125
what job? what are the perks to buying statues?

>>7164400
you’re not alone anon, though i’ve been going for just three weeks. we need to do something to end this for ourselves

at least 1 hour of drawing everyday for more than 3 months now

>>7164122
I've been drawing a couple of hours a day, every day for the past 7 weeks.
I absolutely suck at it and I'm going to end up committing suicide somewhere along the way.

>>7164446
Video games are great for improvement of art skills though. The improve motor functions and hand eye coordination which is vital for artists.

according to krita i somehow clock in 3~4 hours everyday<br>i legit feel like if i stop drawing i'll die

>>7164122
Not often enough. Sometimes I'll start stuff and then get distracted and then revisit it after a month. Pic related was done with a mouse and took me a month to finish. Not because it was hard (it was, using mouse sucks) but because I kept putting it off.

>>7165283
I've played games all my life, unhealthily so, and none of that translated into art skills when I finally started. Fuck off samefagger.

Thanks to this thread i spent like 10 hours banging my head against a wall trying to understand XP-Pen's shitty SDK and making a program that tracks exactly how many seconds i have had my pen touching my screen.

I try to draw every day but I need to be in a good mood first. I need a sunny sky, the temperature needs to not be balls hot, I need to not have a headache, etc.

I haven’t drawn since October because you people told me I was NGMI.

>>7164122
I draw at work for at least 1 hour and try to do at least 1.5 hours a night at home. I usually take a day or 2 off from drawing every now and then to not burn out.

>>7164122
once a week
work fucking sucks
my neck and back are fucking killing me right now
:(

>>7164122
18 hours a day 4-6 days a week
0 hours a day for the rest of the week because I am busy with some ungodly obsessive media binge

Monday to Friday 3 to 4 hours in traditional. Saturdays and Sundays 14 hours digital.<br>I feel like it's not enough.

>>7164432
this. as a proud coomer i draw only when i'm horny. fortunately, following the advice of a wise man, i make sure to be horny every day after work for at least 3-4 hours.

>>7164122
I generally draw prob an hr or 2 each day mostly at work to pass the time on lunch breaks.

>>7164122
An hour daily on avg. But comms got me a little deeper than usual recently so about 2-3

I usually just masturbate most of the day but sometimes I get around to drawing

Generally 1-2 hours a day, digital. Sometimes none, sometimes 15-30 minutes traditional, others up to 10 hours digital.

I think about drawing all day and I move the pen around for 2 hours a day but I only make about 30 minutes of actual unique content that did not exist before. Most of my time is spent thinking and CTRL-Zing

>>7164122
Everyday, every break at work, its the only thing i find fun

>>7165408
>Pic related was done with a mouse
Still not buying it

>>7164122
Like once a week.
ADHD is a bitch.

>>7168787
Would you buy it for a Scooby Snack?

>>7164122
I've never drawn anything. I've copied drawings, but that seems like a completely different skill.

>>7164122
5+ hours per weekday and 12+ hours on the weekends. I wish I was a neet so I'd draw 12+ daily.

I don't draw enough. I wonder if I just don't like drawing that much.

>>7164122
Like 1-3 hours. I try to get a drawing done (at least inking) every day. Even if I absolutely don't feel like it or if I hate what I'm drawing.

>>7164122
I'd say 2 hours a day at least. Hard to draw less honestly, I'm having a lof of fun. I have a lot of free time and I work from home. Really easy to get multiple reps in of figure/gesture drawing.

>>7165283
Jerking off is great for improvement of art skills though. It improves motor functions and hand dick coordination which is vital for artists.

>>7170667
>Jerking off is great for improvement of art skills though
this. if your schedule doesn't look like this, you're NGMI

I wonder why I care about drawing so much despite not being able to draw for more than 20 minutes a day. I wish there was a way to get myself to draw more, but I don't think it's possible


>traditional painters can make the transition to digital almost effortlessly and very quickly make art that better than digital ""painters"" who have been doing it for years
>digital ""painters"" seemingly regress to near /beg/ levels if you make them do anything traditional
Really makes you ponder. The same also holds true with sculpting vs digital sculpting. Digital in general is an impoverished, hacky ""medium""

>>7164433
you do neither and instead make pointless threads to bait pointless arguments

>>7164440
>trying to save others from soulsucking demonic influence is a "waste of time"
Computers are evil

>>7164447
>posts some schizo shit instead of work

>>7164433
>Digital in general is an impoverished, hacky ""medium""
It's just a tool that makes life easier for artists. The whole world moved from analog to digital years ago. It's normal that commercial artists would do the same.
In a sense this is good for traditional media, because it elevates and adds even more value to it.

>>7164447
Why are you using the technology first hand then? You are trying to lecture others on a base of principles, while committing the same "crime". Can't you see how hipocritical this is?

There's plenty of bad trad painters, it's all fundies. Do both.

>>7164458
>It's simply a tool that makes life easier for artists.
That's the problem though. It allows you to skip foundational knowledge and still make acceptable art. You only cheat yourself though. If you mixed your own paint you would have a much deeper understanding of value, how colors mix, etc, than if you just pick it in a color wheel on the computer. When you deal with the restrictions of art mediums you are forced to think in ways that just make you inherently a better, smarter, more capable artist. The digital artist can undo, they can have a million layers, they can just whack at their picture like a retard until they almost accidentally make something that looks okay. All of this is either not possible or so annoying to do traditionally that you are forced to either perpetually make garbage-tier-soccer-mom art or learn your fundamentals at such a high level that you overcome the challenges and become a significantly better artist.

You can argue that a traditional artist who has been painting for the last 15 years might be excused in using digital just for the sake of convenience and that his use of digital wouldn't radically worsen his art (I'd still argue it's a bad idea), but for an artist to start in digital and train in digital? It's just clearly unfortunate and his progress will be handicapped. He's making a deal with the devil and in return he gets to skip the hard work and just be stuck in, at best, /int/ hell.

> You are trying to lecture others on a base of principles, while committing the same "crime"
Technology is just bad. I'm not telling you what to do. What I'm doing right now is bad. It is bad that I am making posts online and talking to people on the internet rather than going outside and communicating with actual humans that are part of a community that I live in. Technology is alienating, it cheapens every facet of your life, it's addictive, etc, but our whole society is built around it. At least get the demons out of your art though.

>>7164433
I'll agree with this. I had to learn trad painting because all digital painting guides were unhelpful and saying "just sample the colors from the reference bro".

>>7164467
You should handwrite your posts instead of typing it where you can just pick the letter you want on a button and you can just backspace your letters until you accidentally make a post that reads okay.

You should also post your work, by mail, on horse, obviously, else you would skip foundational knowledge and cheat yourself out of understanding how the mailing network works

>>7164486
There lies the problem with technology though. I don't value writing that much, so technology allows me to skip over a lot and still be able to communicate with you, but obviously I will write at a lower level than if I had to thoughtfully handwrite my posts. My spelling will be worse because I habitually rely on the computer to correct me whenever I misspell something, my vocabulary will be smaller because technology allowed my engagement with writing to be low enough that I never really developed an interest in expanding it, my overall writing level will be low because reading as a pastime is basically dead because of computer-based entertainment, etc. This is visible in the larger picture when you notice how modern literature looks like it with written by an 8th grader compared to classic literature, which is nearly unreadably advanced for many modern people.

Technology allows you to skip a lot of steps and get to an acceptable point. That's all well and good for me with writing, with math, etc, because I don't care that much about that stuff, but I do care about art, so why would I cheapen it for myself by using technology? Other than pure laziness, there's no excuse. You are actually just making yourself a worse artist

>>7164506
>when you notice how modern literature looks like it with written by an 8th grader compared to classic literature, which is nearly unreadably advanced for many modern people.
my fucking sides

>>7164467
>but for an artist to start in digital and train in digital? It's just clearly unfortunate and his progress will be handicapped.
So what? It's every single individual's choice to make.
I don't disagree with you that having a strong background in trad is a massive benefit, since the mechanics in which the content is produced can be interchangable to an extent (as in you still use a "stylus" and you still make "strokes" picking the right colors, etc.).
But why are you so certain that somebody that is born into digital mediums can't produce content that is valuable?
What you are saying is akin to a renaissance painters not benefitting from doing cave paintings in order to properly understand the craft. (obvously I'm exaggerating things, but it's a similar premise).

>another le trad vs digital shitpost thread
kys

>>7165088
Blood and semen smell better, plus you can get finer brush work unless you regularly have diarrhea.

>>7164433
Everything you say is true and becomes much more apparent when you include AI in the picture >>7164458
>It's just a tool that makes life easier for artists.
You can say the same thing for AI

People need to face it, digital has became a massive joke now

>>7165095
>People need to face it, digital has became a massive joke now
Digital was always a massive joke. Trad artists have been laughing at digital since its inception, and even normies react poorly when you tell them you make digital art. "Oh so the computer does it, uh... good for you," is something most digital artists have heard from friends and family.

Go to any art convention and you'll find that 99% of people value traditional art more than digital. Some guy drawing at his stand on a screen and tablet gets about 10% the respect a guy drawing on a napkin does.

sage

>>7164433
>>traditional painters can make the transition to digital almost effortlessly and very quickly make art that better than digital ""painters"" who have been doing it for years

Name one

Anonymous

>>7165116
You abject retard, that was 80% of artists when digital became a thing. Virtually all of them painted and drew trad before digital, don't you remember? There was a clear skill stratification between people who started with digital and those who had art experience in trad.

There's a reason teachers tried to insist that their students use trad first. Even the drawabox retard tells begs to use real pens because it helps to ingrain knowledge that is useful across all mediums.

>>7165095
If you equate AI to digital painting you're either being dishonest or don't know what you're talking about. Idiotic take. I challenge anyone with an "AI skillset" to start with a blank canvas in photoshop and make something that isn't dogshit.

>>7165099
Mhmm sure. Digital just allows you to not pay stupid prices for supplies and get way more painting practice mileage. You genuinely probably don't want digital artists switching over en masse to traditional. There's a LOT of painting and drawing skill out there in the digital world and a majority of current trad purists will get overshadowed because they're used to being big fish in a small pond.

>>7165124
>Digital just allows you to not pay stupid prices for supplies and get way more painting practice mileage.

Quality>quantity. The mileage you're describing is counterfeit. The undo button alone destroys a beg's ability to truly be cognizant of their sloppy errors. This is why there are begs that have been drawing digital for ten years and still produce work that looks like a second year trad artist.

A digital artist working with deliberate handicaps, sure, maybe. If they don't use undo, don't use canvas flip, and use one of those plugins that mimics traditional color mixing, then you'd have a case. But most don't. So the mileage is deceptive, in the same way an AI fag thinks they're getting mileage out of their style when all they can do is doodle stick figures and haven't even advanced enough to know what their own rendering style might have looked like without a computer approximations.

>>7165124
I'm not equating the act, I'm equating the end result which AI is pretty good at replacing. But if you want to include digital painting, how do you think a lot of digital artists are going to end up using AI tools going forward? Especially for people getting into digital. You're just going to have AI image tracers and AI image fixers, maybe they'll sketch out something really crude and feed it to AI, those will be the new digital artists. As the post I replied to stated, it's a tool to make life easier, people are just going to switch from digitally crafted paintings to AI crafted with digital touchup. I just don't see much of a future for digital art

>>7165132
Fair point. I just think if somebody like Piotr Jablonski went full trad they would be a monster. The crucial understanding is there. Its just a matter of learning the particularities of a medium.

>>7165137
Gotcha. My hope is that healthy gatekeeping and an increased focus on the process holds out and digital survives. I'll switch to trad completely if not.

When it comes down to it, AI threatens the internet and art as a whole. I've already seen a ton of AI traditional stuff (like with a human hand working away and everything) that looked convincing at a glance. Then you have the inevitable horde of people that used to do those boring exact pencil copies of morgan freeman pictures, now just copying midjourney outputs and calling it original. Trad isn't safe either but its safer for now.

>>7164433
i like that i can't endlessly work on trad stuff. if i fuck up on rendering, I can sorta salvage some stuff with whiteout but it's basically part of the piece now. Similarly no mirror tools means my eyes will be off sometimes, I might draw the head too big and not notice until it's too much of a pain to fix it etc.

I just make a note of my mistakes, plan some studies around it and then try to do better on the next piece.

>>7165167
i will say that scanning and color correcting shit is a huge pain and never looks quite right - my stuff looks noticeably worse digitized. Been thinking a decent camera + tripod is the way to go but I'm not sure

>>7164433
I believe this statement has some merit to it, but it's interesting that a good chunk of arguably skilled traditional artists from japan somehow got worse during their switch to digital
it can go both ways i suppose

>>7164440
>>7164447
>>7164456
>”erm pyw”
>drops esoteric knowledge
>”erm pyw wtf”
the state of /ic/

>>7165206
>You've made a line
Oh shit what do you end it with?
>A circle
>A triangle
>A square
>nothing (lame)
>A circle or triangle or square that are filled in or maybe some more squiggly lines.

there you go mystery solved.

That said, I believe demons are real so I'm not exactly hating.

>>7165095
>You can say the same thing for AI
Nah. The mechanisms are completely different. Digital and trad still share the same basic mechanics that require hand to eye coordination.

>>7164447
How much weed do you have to smoke daily to reach this level of insight. Is it possible for a hylic to learn this power?

>>7165258
its literally a boring fad from 2016 twitter discourse youre a decade behind.

>>7165266
I don't use twitter, so that might explain it.

>>7165268
I wasn't the anon, I just wanted to interject and call you a retard because it feels good.

>>7165122
>There was a clear skill stratification between people who started with digital and those who had art experience in trad.
It's almost like the trad artists had previous experience, whil ethe digital ones just started from scratch, because the medium was in its infancy.

You are a complete utter imbecile.

>>7165206
>esoteric knowledge
>admits to being a shitposting schizo
lol

>>7164447
this is embarassing, arent you ashamed to propagate this idiocy?

i looked at your picture and I cant find a single symbol in the upper half that are present on the circuit board?

how fucking retarded are you actually?

>>7165638
nta but you seem like a layman. Have you ever designed a chip? Why are you commenting on a subject you're completely ignorant about? Just to own the "conspiracy nut"?

>>7165651
go to /x/ you schizophrenic retard
I bet you think you're being gangstalked as well
watch out for those red cars retard

>>7165651
wow you are defending this? are you really willing to fight on this hill?

I know enough about chip design to know that some random ancient religious runes are in no way a part of the design and manifacturing process

but please enlighten me how circuit boards are conjured up by black magic if you feel so competent as to judge my knowledge from a single shitpost you shouldnt have a problem going into details

you could also start small and tell me where I can fucking find a single of those goody runes on a regular board

>>7165206
Your "esoteric knowledge" is worthless if you can't express it with art

>>7165091
If your blood and semen smell better you're not a real artist

>>7165122
Are you going to address this?
>>7165547

As soon as your small brain gets exposed, you run. Fucking coward.

>>7165547
Yet the reverse is never true. A skilled digital artist always struggles more when returning to trad. Why is this, if not for the medium itself?
Am a digital artist almost exclusively, btw. Every time I try trad I feel inferior and humiliated. My proportions are all wrong, colors are terrible, linework is bad etc due to over reliance on stabilizers and other 'conveniences' training me to rely on them.
Had a power outage for about a week in my area and went crazy wanting to draw. It dawned on me just how fake of an artist I was.
Anyway, I made all that up and I have no real opinion.

>>7164461
The painting in this OP is pretty shitty for example. Lifeless, flat and cartoonish. Euros did not understand painting like the Russians did.

>>7166100
It's because traditional requires a different, more complex skillset (color mixing, lack of shortcuts, undo, etc.). Digital makes your life easier, as it simplifies the process.
My issue is with people that treat this as if it's something that should be ridiculed.
If you draw exclusively digital it's normal that switching to a different medium doesn't bear the same fruit. And no, you will never convince me that a solely traditional painter will produce the same results by going to digital. It will take them probably less time to adapt tho, that's true.
Feeling inferior because of a trivial matter like this seems just a you problem.

>>7166284
>Digital makes your life easier, as it simplifies the process.
Then why not just use AI with img2img. It also simplifies the process by removing complex things like rendering in the same way manual digital art removes color mixing, short cuts and undo. Just keep doing the bare minimum.
If the challenge is trivial, then every digital artist should just use AI because it makes things easier, it just simplifies the process, right?
Anyone who started out with digital didn't start out with it because they thought it would allow them to produce the best art they could produce. They started with it because in the back of their minds, they were too lazy and too scared to tackle the challenge of traditional. They valued ease and efficiency over developing skill, convenience over deep contact with the process.

>>7164433
make something traditionally that's comparable in quality to a good digital painting and I'm pretty sure you'd get paid 5 times as much
why is it always some tradnigger seething over digital? actually just a nigger without the 'trad' because I bet this faggot OP is just a permabeg blaming the medium for his lack of skill

>>7166316
>Then why not just use AI with img2img.
Because I prefer to make my own stuff. Simplyifying things that don't affect the end result (eg color mixing or setting up a canvas) is not the same as altering the end result.
The AI analogy is a stretch anon.

>Anyone who started out with digital didn't start out with it because they thought it would allow them to produce the best art they could produce. They started with it because in the back of their minds, they were too lazy and too scared to tackle the challenge of traditional. They valued ease and efficiency over developing skill, convenience over deep contact with the process.
This is BS generalization. One of the biggest benefits of digital is ease of use (traditional media is messy and expensive af) and most artist go that route because it speeds up the process (while still retaining the authors full control, before you start with the BS AI analogies again).

This is true. Painter Andrew Tischler made a drawing with Procreate for the first time and this was the result. Although he already has experience with digital art (he worked in Photoshop), the result for his first attempt is very good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1G<wbr>IgpRC5A8

>>7164447
>evil
Define "evil".

>>7165222
The patterns on both sides are so varied that it's statistically easy to find correlations, especially if we're being loose.

>>7166431
Nathan Fowkes did the transition when he worked on le-whatever-famous-movie-but-not-pr<wbr>ince-of-egypt. I don't recall him saying it was effortless though, but I feel like he's often staging himself, so it's hard to tell how much is true...

But the other anon is right, the movie industry shifted from acrylic or gouache to digital at some point, and all trad artists had to learn digital, apparently without too many issues.

>>7166431
>Although he already has experience with digital art (he worked in Photoshop)
wow, it's fucking nothing

>>7164433
Yes. They are already used to no-layer drawing. Digital artists tend to overuse layers.

When the artist whose trained on no layers comes to a media where you can choose to use only 1 layer, he can do well. When the artist who is too used to using multiple layers comes to trad media, it can be difficult to adjust at first.

>>7164433
I don't have the time, money, space, or ability to carry a bunch of paintings around with me as I move every 6 months kys.

>>7164433
Is charcoal and graphite above digital art?


Post overrated paintings. Here is that ugly painting of Lucifer beloved by edgelords and pussies who think it’s deep.

>>7164534
Why is the OP consistently a faggot in this board anyway? How come more than half of the threads in this board open up with a faggot OP?

>>7164534
calm down and be happy! smile!

>>7164534
>t. one of the snobs who shitted on that painting back then
I don't care, the stare is iconic and the painting overall evokes emotions so it's fine. Much better than all of those classical paintings/portraits that make you feel nothing

>>7164534
I like this painting because i want him to give me a little smooch

>>7164562
>>7164565
>>7164575
There are superior French artist and gene picture of Lucifer. He just looks like a wimpy bitch in that.

>>7164534
What's deep about it? It's just a hot depiction of the original seethelord.

>>7164534
Not overrated, it is the trope maker.

I love how character design principles have basically remained unchanged. Look at that boy's fiery, tangled red hair. It says everything you need to know about his mentality, his themes and role in the story. The angularity of his muscles and triangular brow reinforce the design, as well the wings obscured in shadow, the thorns and the single tear drop, signifying his emotionality, but not hysteria. The single tear indicates the presence of a strong emotion, but the fact that it is but one drop represents control. He is a troubled yet cunning edgelord that does not give in to rage or despair, but instead plots and schemes while suppressing his outward display of emotion. Pushed hard enough, perhaps he would crack and reveal the hysterical shrieking envy and jealousy and pride he holds within.

His hands clasped together with fingers pointing in different directions represents that his works are chaotic, dis unified. From his hands he brings disorder into Jordan Peterson's universe.

I also think that there is meaning behind the placement of his eye along the vertical line leading to his nipple but I am not high enough to understand it yet.

>>7164534
Bruh this is an objectively good painting. It's also not ugly. You're stupid.

>>7164825
This is the guy from the Joker movie

>>7164534
It's a great painting but honestly I've always hated the way the arms are posed. You can see in his preliminary study a year before that the arm closest to us was crossing across the upper body and braced on a rock behind him while the other hand held his head. I understand why he made the changes he made but my god those clamped hands look stupid as hell the more I look at them.

>>7165912
But he just looks like a pussy crying in the corner in that one. The clamped hands are what gives him his signature edge, like he's just filled with petulant seethe

>>7164539
A lot of ‘artists’ are vain idiots with no interest besides clout, and with the education of a potato. This was a minority problem in the old days, now it is a catastrophic majority due to social media frying everybody’s brains.

Then you have to add dogshit moderation that deletes good threads and keeps bad ones up. This is because jannies -and you always had to be a faggot to be a janny to begin with, even back then- are not immune to the brain-fry effect of social media.

Finally over the past year and a half there’s been an influx of AIschizos from /pol/ and /g/ trying to attack ‘artists’. Since these guys are terminally online nuts who again, have the education of a potato, their conception of an artist is a Twitter leftoid shilling patreon porn, so they’ve proceeded on their crusade of shitting up /ic/ with the zeal of a lunatic that’s finally found a valid target. And of course, because of the moderation problem I already mentioned, they won’t be shut down.

tl;dr it’s FUCKED, the internet is over, it is all downhill from here and discussion will get worse, not better

>>7166401
Well yeah. That's what the internet was for to begin with. You didn't think this military run CIA organized technology was made for the betterment of mankind, did you? People were calling out its dangers long before they shoved it down our throats. Anyone using it is complicit in its continued replacement of all values with greed, narcissism, mental illness and profiteering. This isn't new, everyone with a brain said this would happen and those without brains (the majority) didn't listen because OH LOOK YOU CAN SEND MESSAGES TO PEOPLE AND LOOK AT PORN DURR HURR

Anyway, like comment and subscribe.

Haha wow it looks like 90% of /ic/ CAN'T FUCKING STAY ON TOPIC FOR EVEN TWO POSTS!!!!<br>Don't worry op I'll contribute. You can find so so so much bad anatomy in the early 1600s to late 1700s period before observation and rendermonkey cope became king to hide the lack of knowledge. Here's just one example from Titian, who yeah, couldn't draw like Michelangelo said.

>>7167664
>You can find so so so much bad anatomy in the early 1600s to late 1700s period
And it doesn't matter in the slightest

>>7167674
Based retard based retard enjoyer.

>>7166379
This. What makes this the perfect Lucifer is not the palpable suffering in falling from grace, but the refusal to accept it was his fault.


Did you make it anon?
Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
Would your work make your childhood self proud?
re you drawing the kind of illustrations that shaped your brain as a child and created that artistic desire that fueled you in the first place?
You didn't give up right?
You didn't let that part of you die

I was obsessed with porn and violence as a child.

>>7164249
Actually yes, I'm drawing exactly what my ten year old self would want to read. And no, I'm not obsessed with sex or violence. Thanks for asking

Honestly, yeah. And it feels fucking great.

>>7164249
Tastes change, so I don't really care too much if I'm drawing something my child self would find cool. It's probably a lot more dry than what child me would have liked.
That said, it is good to reflect and see if you're on the right path.

>>7164249
>You didn't give up right?
>You didn't let that part of you die
;_;

>>7164249
I want to stop visiting /ic/, everytime I come here I feel nothing but hate, it brings the worst out of me. I should be drawing now.

The characters that I invented when I was 12 are still around in my writings, but with more sophisticated problems to resolve. My younger self would be intrigued by their adventures, but would invent different ones,just because.

>>7164249
>Would your work make your childhood self proud?
Yes, but I don't give a shit about him, it's my current self that I can't make proud.
Art is a constant chase.

>>7164353
Good, let the hate flow through you

>Suspended for drawing the Ninja Turtles "doing it" with April O'Neil while the Power Rangers killed my teacher as a kid.
>Older me: Would my 10 year old self want this?

>>7164249
I made it
I can draw decently
I got likes on twitter
now I have nothing else to strive for. I hit my level cap.
Now I get why pros like AI, I'm just tired. I'm tired of drawing and I want to be rewarded.

>>7164249
I can now draw characters from novels I read as a child that were never popular enough to get fanart. Now in 3 minutes I can draw full body sketches of my favourite niche characters. 10 year old me would've unironically had me as an idol. When I look at my old drawings and redraw them, it's an instant dopamine boost.

I don't even remember ny childhood or what I was thinking. Just footnotes

>>7164251
This, honestly.
Porn wise I'm drawing what child me would have wanted
But I haven't drawn many violent things, maybe I am letting child me down

>>7164249
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
I spent my first ten years drawing naked anime girls and animals, monsters and dinosaurs disemboweling eachoter. I had a bucket full of spent red and pink markers, the other colors lasted until I reached teenage years and started only doing black and white
I was fucked from the start mate

>>7164249
>Did you make it anon?
Yes, I live off my art.
>Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
I never experienced that. A s child all I cared about was playing and having fun.
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
I'm not.
>Would your work make your childhood self proud?
No idea. As a child I didn't care about that.
Does it make my younger self proud? Yes, in terms of art skills I would be mad envious of current me.
>re you drawing the kind of illustrations that shaped your brain as a child and created that artistic desire that fueled you in the first place?
Kinda. 70s and 80s anime was my biggest influence, and I think I applied a lot of that to my current art.
>You didn't give up right?
Still trying to improve my craft, even tho, now that I focus on quicker results that definitely took a toll on the quality.
>You didn't let that part of you die
I like to think I still have some of that kid somewhere deep in my brain, yeah. At least I try not to be too cinical about anything in life. It's harder the older I get tho.

>>7164249
I'm not drawing anything, though.

>>7164249
>Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?

The first drawings I made I still have from the time I was ~10yo are:
>a girl in bikini
and
>goku-like guy fighting piccolo-like guy, both doused in blood

>lmao. That pic
HALLO, ICH BIN'S WIEDER, EUER SCHLAAAAUKOPF!

>>7164249
Creating stuff makes me happy had I love doing that. But honestly I should visit this board less, although it helped me hone my skills, there's less and less of artists helping each other here and more of just hate recently.

>>7164584
Mine were
>girl in bikini
>a robot
>a monster fighting a samurai with a katana

Now I draw robot girls in samurai themed bikinis fighting monsters with katanas, really special stuff.

>>7164249
>Did you make it anon?
Kind of don't care about it but if i had to have some goal, it would be making comic strips or funny images. That is what i enjoy.
>Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
Mostly.
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
I'm not even remotely interested in that.
>Would your work make your childhood self proud?
Don't think so. My imaginative skill hasn't improved much from when i was a kid.
>Are you drawing the kind of illustrations that shaped your brain as a child and created that artistic desire that fueled you in the first place?
Still working on that but i just can't help thinking i'm still missing technique and the right tools.
Sometimes the digital canvas feels too small to draw what i imagine, or lines coming out jagged despite fidgeting with settings.
>You didn't give up right?
>You didn't let that part of you die
Nah.

>>7166141
>samurai themed bikinis
show, I'm curious

>>7164249
i honestly can't even remember why i started drawing in the first place, it's just something i did, and still do

>>7164249
>Did you make it anon?
Yes. It was a long and difficult road but I make my living doing what I love now.
>Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
Everyday. I had written drawing prompts for myself to open in the future when I got good enough. I only have a few left.
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
I was never obsessed with porn or violence.
I do occasionally get commissions for them though when I open coms up.
>Would your work make your childhood self proud?
He would because I am.
>re you drawing the kind of illustrations that shaped your brain as a child and created that artistic desire that fueled you in the first place?
I still draw cartoon characters and anime characters occasionally. Feels like Saturday morning.
>You didn't give up right?
Not even once.
>You didn't let that part of you die
It's alive and thriving.

>>7164249
>Did you make it anon?
No, i've tried though
>Do you draw the kind of things you dreamed of drawing as a child?
I didn't have any artistic desire as a child. Some brief shonen excitements as a teenager though. All in all i'm not drawing anything like that
>Would your work make your childhood self proud?
It's at the same level as his, so no
>>7164249
>you drawing the kind of illustrations that shaped your brain as a child and created that artistic desire that fueled you in the first place?
No, i didn't have any of those really and i'm not making anything other than sporadic and shortlived attempts at practice
>You didn't give up right?
I did. Many times over and over again. I'll try again and likely fail again. Hopefully not but it's not up to me.
>You didn't let that part of you die
It desicated long while ago. I'm keeping it on heavy life support.

Picrel is literally from 3 years ago when i was first trying. Someone told me i had a talent for it and then i proceeded to get sad and do absolutely nothing until right now.
If i didn't commit in the last three years i probably won't ever.
Hopefully i'm wrong though

>>7164249
I have died many times over, since my childhood. I don't even remember why I started drawing I. The first place.

>>7164249
What media is this image from? I scrolled past it twice and then nostalgia hit me like a truck. It feels like I have seen this guy a billion times and I can hear him talking in my head but I can't remember where he's from...

>>7167199
It's from Art Attack!! I remember now! Must've been twenty years ago or so when this aired...

>>7164249
>>7164251
>>7164253
>>7164527
>>7164258
You’re right anons i should be drawing the porn and violence young me wanted.

>>7164249
>Before you were obsessed with porn and violence?
>I don't care about porn and 2025 will ban it.
I wasn't an artist back then, I didn't draw at all.
I remember tracing a comic once but that's it.
Unless you count using toys as actors, but then I'd be a storyteller, not an artist, and 3D animation would work just as well.

>>7167261
I MAKE NOVELTY DRAWINGS NOT PORN. YOU GONNA BAN MEDICAL
TEXTBOOKS NEXT?

>>7164249
I wanted to be an architect. I never got to be one

>>7167328
Me too I was turned on by buildings, now I don't anymore

>>7164249

The skills I have now, I thought I'd have them by 40 years old.

I'm 27 now, and instead of making more art
I enjoy watching art and knowing what's good and what's bad.
What's good and what's excellent.

The bad side, is that instead of motivating me,
getting more skills gave me the
'already did that, I don't need to do it anymore' feeling.

>>7164249
FUCK ART ATTACK, THOSE GLUE + TOILET PAPER MIXES NEVER WORKED, THE RESULT WAS VERY ROUGH AND THE CONSISTENCY WAS NOT HARD ENOUGH TO HOLD PROJECTS TOGETHER

The only thing I ever did from the show that I enjoyed the result of was a set of Squashed Thingies, because they were retard proof. I still have them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbK<wbr>SRsVB8e0

>>7164249
had I drawn back then, my child (12 to 20) self would have draw porn
but current me doesn't want to draw it and wants to draw scenery, trees, rocks and buildings.


Reminder that japs literally learn by ripping off other artists while you retards waste your time reading loomis.

>>7164805
Original > imitators.
This surrender to mediocrity and aping is always a cope. Without the original, none of this exists. Be a pioneer, not a follower.

Is there a Japanese equivalent of /ic/? I really wonder what their perception is like

>>7164805
Reminder that OP is a faggot who doesn't draw and wastes his time shitposting.

>>7164805
That explains why so many manga panels are just a tracing of photos and other manga.
Look up Hunter x Hunter and Slam Dunk.

>>7164817
Nothing is original, bub, not even your chinese cartoons.
Everything always comes from somewhere else.

>>7164805
It’s shocking I know but some of us still aspire to more than bug-eyed chink scribbles and patreon porn money.

>>7164889
Renaissance masters learned by copying and sometimes even traced.

>>7164831
I'm curious about this too, does 2chan have art learning board ?

>>7164889
>some of us still aspire to more than bug-eyed chink scribbles and patreon porn money
lmao

>>7164835
drawing is not sacred. You're not better than others because you draw.

>>7164831
>>7164901
i would be interested in knowing this, too

>>7164856
No shit retard. We're all made of stardust.

Doesn't change the fact that some of that start dust became people, and some of it became maggots. I can guess which one you are.

I said surrendering to mediocrity and aping makes one a follower. If you want to be a follower instead of a pioneer, be a follower, just prepared to get called out for being a mediocre copyist, like 99% of the homogenized anime trash that's floating around out there.

Choosing the easiest laziest option is not and will never be a virtue.

>>7165026
But it does make him better at drawing than you will ever be. And this is a drawing board, you subhuman. So what the fuck are you doing here? Think you're special because you don't draw?

You're not special because you don't draw. You're not better than those who do draw. See where that leaves us, dumbass?

>>7164805
explain to me how animators can adapt a light novel or VN with literally no manga equivalent to copy from? They just make up all the scenes from thin air?

>>7165089
The imagination is a hard concept for people with no imagination to imagine.

>>7165090
So we agree here that the person with imagination (originators) are > imitators like what >>7164817 said and without the imaginatiors the imitators would not survive?

>>7165087
>because you don't draw?
>you don't draw
Look at this schizo making assumptions about people they don't personally know.
Didn't realized you had psychic powers lmao

>>7164805
lol aihara literally goes brrrrr

>>7165092
That's assuming that the imagination is an innate trait, which I don't entirely think it is. I think it's more like a choice.

Ambitious originators (the ones who were responsible for creating all of the major cultural canons in both art, music, film, TV, games, etc) are all highly driven and independent. What they share in particular is a desire to STAND APART from the mass. These reasons could be genetic, it could be cultural, or circumstantial. It's usually all three.

However, we're a species that transmits knowledge. Anyone can learn to be independent, ambitious and imaginative, but most people don't bother because of excuses. "It's too hard, I'm too weak, I need someone else to do the work for me, I just want to make money and have no authentic love for what I do, waa." We call these artists those with "bad incentives" because all they do is retread the path a pathfinder laid out. They don't actually love art, nor do they love the process of creation, nor do they have anything to say, because they aren't willing to try.

Copying other artists can be useful, but without the fundamentals in place, all you're doing is regurgitating words you read in a book with no actual understanding of it. This is why blatant imitators in other industries (like film or games) are scoffed at. Think of all the huge piles of worthless Dark Souls knockoffs, or the endless stream of generic anime waifus. Imagine how much more vibrant the memetic ecosystem would be the average imitator got off their ass and actually tried to build their own damn boat for once.

>>7165097
>Didn't realized you had psychic powers lmao
Don't need to be psychic to know you're retarded. Hope someone you love dies soon.

>>7165117
>Hope someone you love dies soon.
lmao
Look at this tough motherfucker.

>>7165134
Do you want me to look at the tough motherfucker or you?

>>7165134
>Schizo
>Tranny
>Neurotic
It all makes sense now.

>>7165148
Thanks for engaging with the bait.
I legit don't draw, I just come here to argue points I don't believe in because I'm bored.

>>7165166
holy shit this persons a fucking lunatic, I want to see more. I've never seen someone get so mad at the internet before, I'm intrigued

>>7165107
Dark Souls isn't original though

>>7165278
It's more original than its imitators.

Are you seriously defending mindless copying over the invention of new ideas with this semantic retardation? Everything is derived from something else, some things are more derived than others. That's what defines generic slop. Tolkien's work was original (comparatively) at the time, the works that followed (his countless apers) were not. The only way to make that formula interesting is to invest personal uniqueness, ambition or chaos into it.

Copiers, apers, imitators are like mongrels interbreeding out of control. There's no fresh genetic material, no unexpected edges, no surprises, just rote repetition until total dissolution. It's no wonder the japs are the weebs are stagnant

>>7165089
It’s a matter of interpretation. The director gives directions to the animators and they work on shit based on that. However, just like with any book to show adaptation, there are loads of inaccuracies and cut content depending on how much they want to squish together in one season. The lead animator/director does the draft and the animators follow up on it.

>>7165166
>>7165252
imagine the seethe this negroid feels everytime he sees ppl drawing and reminding him of his failure...very kek

>>7164805
He says you need to use references

>>7164805
yeah, constructoids are a blight.

>>7164805
If the "just copy other artists to learn" part is true then which artists should we copy then?

>>7164805
American comics still dying even with Inclusiong of gay and niggers

Japanese comics is dying because not enough children are replacing the manchildren reading the comics

Korean webtoons is the future

>>7164805
ALL
OF
US
LEARN BY COPYING/ MIMICKING/ RIPPING OFF OTHER ARTISTS
it's not exclusive to manga.
it's not exclusive to japs.
hell it's not exclusive to drawing either.
that's how we learn to do anything, from the most basic skill like speaking our own language and communicating with other people.
>using loomis's (or other artists) methods
imo also count as "ripping off" said artist because it was him that created the method and you are the person who are trying to imitate it.
and if we go further, the method can probably be traced back to knowledge and methods that came from older artists, and so on.
coying other is just as important as learning fundamentals too and i don't why a lot of people make a fuss about either of those.
also OP's pic is too exaggerated for just telling artists to get a proper reference for drawing.

>>7164805
>LOOK AND DRAW LOOK AND DRAW
well, how the fuck do I even do that?

>>7164805
>even i can draw well if i look-and-draw like this
>his manga looks like utter crap

>>7165535
>Japanese comics is dying
Huh? No it's not, not even remotely.

>>7166682
just so you know this is satire.

>>7165535
>Japanese comics is dying
lmao

>>7165535
>Korean webtoons is the future
They're okay, but the artstyle is usually hideous.

>>7164805
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYO<wbr>RCma17o4
we done BEEN known this

I wish I could travel to the future, copy popular art, and then come back and post it before they do

>>7165535
Manga's audience grows exponentially each passing day

>>7165976
you need an IQ of at least 80
there are third worlders with no access to the internet doing art
even cavemen were doing this shit

>>7164831
>>7164901
>>7165042
Are you guys serious? Have you never been to 2chan?


>>7164921
if you don't have fun you're NGMI
simple as that

>>7164921
have you tried having fun once in your life?

>>7164921
People who think about effort-to-reward ratios in the first place probably aren't suited for art. Best pivot into accounting or marketing, or trade work like electrician or plumber.
It's the same with bodybuilding, marathon runners, health junkies, etc. If you ask "why is that guy torturing himself to get strong when he's just going to get old and die anyway," you aren't ever going to understand the innate drive or the pleasure it creates.

>>7164925
Someone like physical activity does benefit you in the long term
>i do thing to strengthen my body
>body is stronger

Effort-to-reward mentality is literally what the human is wired for.
Art itself is a genuine unnatural pursuit and an useless skill and you either have to have lots of discipline and self-control to go against your nature, or be mentally ill.
The latter is what the majority of artists fall into, hence the stereotype.

>>7164921
>Just live for 80 years on average to see if you're among the 10% of people with the right neurology and birth and cultural circumstances to have enjoyed the ride.
Welcome to the existential sewer of time and space. I recommend Buddhism.

>>7164931
Not quite. Humans have been creating art since the dawn of consciousness because it consciousness (and the imagination it brings) exist in a feedback loop. You cannot have problem solving without creativity, and for creativity, you need the imagination. Drawing is a means of strengthening the part of the imagination that engages in a feedback loop with visual stimuli, and it feels innately good for that reason. It's why kids compulsively scribble and doodle and enter into a trance when doing so. It's the same with music, writing, etc.

> lots of discipline and self-control to go against your nature, or be mentally ill

It takes discipline and self control to go against parts of our nature, but that doesn't make it inherently pointless. It takes discipline to not get drunk all the time, but that doesn't mean resistance is a bad thing. It also takes discipline and self control not to shit yourself in public.

The stereotype is born of a failure to understand that artists have to draw to relieve neurotic tension. If artists don't draw, they go crazy. This phenomena has been studied and documented for a long time.

>i do thing to strengthen my body
>body is stronger

Same logic.

>I draw to strengthen my drawings.
>drawings are stronger.

Like with bodybuilding, there's no cap on growth until death. And it feels good to draw intrinsically (far better than cooming or consuming media or talking to people or working out or engaging in politics or playing video games,) so why I see no reason not to draw.

>>7164921
>Worries about the effort-to-reward ratio
There's your answer, art isn't for you. You either have fun or you'll never see the value.

>>7164921
You're retarded.
You'll be able to tell if you haven't improved at all after like a single month.
What you said is like fat bitches saying they won't go to the gym because they don't want to be muscley freaks, as if you just instantly become buff one day.

>>7164925
Nah, effort to reward is fine, you just need to learn how to identify rewards other than financial and physical pleasure. Working out and Drawing both provide massive rewards for relativiely little work.

>>7164921
My reward for trying to climb to a settled int is that i sleep better, can actually focus when working, have something to look forward too and I can help others express their toughts in a visual form which gives me a feling that it was not all for naught

>>7164922
>>7164924
Drawing isn't supposed to be "fun"
>t. Worked in concept art

>>7165382
>>t. Worked in concept art
You faggots can't draw anyway Kek. You leverage on safe design choices and call yourselves ""designers"" to compensate for terrible draftsmanship and painting skills.
You smug faggots are cringe as fuck, concept art will die.

>>7164921
>participate in the lowest effort-to-reward ratio "hobby" in existence
that would be writing. People are a lot more willing to engage with visual art than writing

>>7164924
the world doesn't allow me to have fun

>>7165382
that's because it was your job, anon. Work sucks.

>>7164921
>just practice for 5 years to see if you're among the 10% of people with the right neurology to participate in the lowest effort-to-reward ratio "hobby" in existence
Little known secret, the 10% are everyone who had the discipline to last 5 years. 90% of artists quit before making it.
Also if you don't find the process itself rewarding, NGMI.

There's this interview with Peter Han where he says something like "many of my students tell me they feel demoralised, they don't feel like drawing. I never felt like that. Drawing is like a game to me." I don't know how you are supposed to get good if you aren't like that. It's just something you are born with I guess. Talent, if you will

>>7165543
Why do people want to draw if they dont enjoy it? i have irl friends who are like this and i cant fucking understand...its not like you can make secret cash from it

>>7165567
People want to draw well but don't want to grind fundies and get through the required 10000 shitty drawings first. It's about the end result, not the process itself. At least for me.

>the right neurology
Vgh the ultra rare neurological ability to... form myelin

>>7165567
For me it's a childhood dream that I can't let go off

>>7164942
I'm glad I'm not the shitposter you replied to, I would feel so humiliated

>>7164921
>the lowest effort-to-reward ratio "hobby" in existence
Novel writing?

>>7166020
No that's competitive vidya.
Spend 8 hours a day playing fighting games, hope you get good enough to get sponsored or win tournaments (requires high IQ of 115 + to make it to higher echelons) constantly have to pay out the ass to stay up to date with the games and consoles, need to travel and burn through savings and attend tournaments, hit age 25, experience slow down of reaction speed due to aging, get knocked out of the game, wake up from the daze and realize that games were a mistake, and the biggest mistake was you.
Afterwards you can retire by becoming an announcer that gets paid pennies and still has to do all the shit mentioned above without the glory. Unlike with art, you don't even leave anything behind.

>>7164925
>Am an eletrician
>Want nothing more than to be able to draw, just as a hobby
>Too tired to make meaningful strides after work
>People keep saying you need thousands of hours to get to mediocority
>Slowly losing the remainders of my motivation
Such is life.

>>7166086
>Want nothing more than to be able to draw, just as a hobby
Doubtful.

>>7165599
Im not grinding fundies and im having fun improving...sure ill sprinkle some "studies" inbetween but its definetely not annoying because i can see myself get better

Also, on an unrelated note, is it weird if i think wanting to draw when you never drew/expressed any creative values as a kid is a little silly?

>>7166094
Which part?
Why would i lie about wanting to do something like that?
Do i have anything to gain from making anonymous strangers think that i(anonymous poster) would like to get into a hobby?
That's just bizzare

>>7166222
If you wanted "nothing more" than to draw just as a hobby, then why do you need thousands of hours to get to mediocrity? Why does the idea of being mediocre bother you? Why does the idea of needing to make meaningful strides bother you? Why would you lose your motivation if it's what you want more than anything?
Bad incentives. Bad incentives everywhere. Instead you're using what precious time and energy you have here. If it matters that much to you, go draw.

>>7165478
Lots of these in the last 2 years

I don't know how to even reach the point where I can tell whether or not I enjoy drawing. When I watch people draw, I can't understand what I'm seeing well enough to imitate it, but I can tell it's conpletely unlike anything I've ever done.

>>7165478
What do you mean, that's what the /beg/ thread is for.

>>7166289
Fundamentals. You need the fundamentals.

Don't spend too much time comparing yourself to other people drawing, especially pros as they have reached a point of such internalization of knowledge that many seem to skip things like construction and guidelines, etc. But they are making those calculations in their head.

It's like watching a guitar player close his eyes and play a solo. He can only do that because he memorized every possibility on the fretboard and knows exactly by feel alone where those notes are. Being able to close your eyes and play by feel alone is the end game. It's the same with artists that just seem to 'know' where every line should go.

It's the same with fundies and why I hate the internet for tricking begs into thinking that artists just miraculously just know how to see and draw. You need to internalize the fundamentals before you can get to that point, and that requires study.

Harsh reality is that study is part of the process. If you don't enjoy studying and learning for its own sake, you probably aren't going to like drawing much. Drawing is like a game in that way. If you don't enjoy struggling against obstacles because you can, you won't enjoy it intrinsically enough to sustain interest.

>>7166307
whenever i hear artists try to defend drawing they give like 100 reasons to not even bother in a span of a few sentences, lmfao

>>7166308
They give 100 reasons for low IQ niggers like you not to bother, yes.

>In order to get healthy, you'll need to work out--
>whenever i hear people try to defend exercising, they give like 100 reasons to not even bother in a span of a few sentences, lmfao obese4ever

>>7166320
>erm actually you need an iq of 120 to draw anime shit
great, you just filtered basically everybody alive
dont bitch to me when nobody "appreciates" it like you and ai replaces you wholesale

>>7166323
I don't care if you don't appreciate drawing because this is a board for people who like to draw. You're a tourist having a tantrum. Go make some friends and find fulfillment in life.

>>7166323
You were filtered the moment you were born.
Have fun with that AI, though, I hear there's a bunch of new workflows that will take your coomshit to the next level!

>>7166326
i imagine the people of jericho thought something similar to you, my defiant friend

>>7166307
People who don't enjoy the climb aren't really human. Enjoying struggle is the difference between a man and a cow.

>>7166333
I'm sorry you were hurt and that you wound up here. I really am. I can understand that drawing isn't for you, but that's okay. People need and want different things out of life, and it's clear that drawing is not one of those things for you.

It's okay to want vengeance, but in the end, if you chose to waste your life on this pursuit only to find out it wasn't suited for your sensibilities, the fault is yours for being so gullible.

>>7166335
That isn't even close to what the anon said. The anon effectively said that enjoying climbing is essential to wanting to be a climber. You're projecting your own insecurities into it because you feel inferior.
You're not even trying anymore, dude. Get help, this is just sad behavior.

>>7166337
>the fault is yours for being so gullible
very true. all people should be dissuaded from drawing immediately so that it's rendered a dead relic.

>>7166349
I think many people should be dissuaded from drawing. That's why schools used to reject applicants, it ultimately saved a lot of folks a lot of trouble. But this is 4chan. Presumably you're here because you understand that this is the internet, and it isn't meant to be taken too seriously.

As for drawing becoming a dead relic, that's unlikely. A relic, perhaps, but that doesn't make it any less valuable to the people who enjoy it. There are still trad artists and sculptors who enjoy the craft. Your resentment towards drawing isn't going to help you much in life.

If you feel like you wasted your life pursuing art for whatever reason, why waste more time obsessing over what other people do and do not enjoy doing with their own time? What drives this need to validate your choices and life in the eyes of others?

>>7166349
Do not worry sirs, by 2026 President Altman will make drawing illegal under the death penalty. The oppressed IT class will flourish, and the creative elite cabal will be executed.

when will all of you realize it’s all talent and genetics and hardly related to effort.<br>i realized i had the genetic inclination when my father mentioned his fascination with architecture at a young age, so i just assumed i’d enjoy drawing too

>>7166455
>guhnetics
the only "genetic" aspect here is your lack of intelligence, you're stupid so you can't figure out how to improve

>>7166308
if you need someone to "list" you reasons as to why you should draw, why are you even here?
you learn to draw because you desire to draw
it's that simple

>>7166540
Yes
IQ is 100 percent genetic and can be a factor

>>7166545
>IQ is 100 percent genetic and can be a factor
the fact that you can
>beat someone's head in and give them brain damage
>starve a child so they never grow to their full potential
highlights how bullshit this statement is

>>7165401
>>7166020
yeah drawing is a struggle but writers absolutely have it worse. I can't imagine trying to pursue it as a job, I'd probably kill myself 10 times over

>>7166236
>why do you need thousands of hours to get to mediocrity
It's not fun to output garbage
>Why does the idea of needing to make meaningful strides bother you?
Doubtful that i can + not satisfied with where i am right now.
>Why would you lose your motivation if it's what you want more than anything
Skitzo mental damage. I'm horribly scared of being genuine. This included attempting a hobby in the earnest.
>If it matters that much to you, go draw
I'll go do that right now

>>7166323
>erm actually you need an iq of 120 to draw anime shit
 It comes from the country with the highest average IQ in the world after all.

>>7166540
so you agree with him?
>captcha: HRT

>>7165382
>t. Worked in concept art
t[ry animating then faggot

I've been drawing for my entire life and I still can't draw a fucking circle. When I draw a line, its just luck if it goes where I want or not. Drawing parallel lines and curves is just impossible, like cross hatching. I have to concentrate really hard like I'm a fucking retard.

>>7164922
>>7164924
how do you guys find enjoyment in creating art when you're simultaneously bad at it and aren't improving? I'm not even trying to whine, genuinely how do you get past this mental roadblock? It's really easy to enjoy the thought of making a beautiful piece, until you try your absolute best to put something onto paper and it looks like vomit.
how do you not want to throw in the towel if everything you create is hot garbage?

>>7167995
You have to work within the limitations, see: ONE.
He tries his best with what he can do even when he was still a complete uttershit /beg/.
If you earnestly try to bruteforce things that are currently beyond your skill level you'll eventually get to something that you otherwise wouldnt.
Essentially, act like an oblivious retard and draw literally everything you ever wanted to to the best of your ability

>>7167995
Creating hot garbage forever >>> not creating anything ever
and this comes from a permabeg

>>7166081
Video games are biggest waste of time in existence. I lost 10 years to them and still feel lucky that I manage to quit. Fuck them

>>7164931
Anon sounds like they're about to violently fall in love.

>>7166564
Likedrawfags, most career writefags have to go make corporate goyslop like adverts, grant requests and training manuals. Otherwise it's the same deal of trying to become a viral meme name like GRRM or Rowling independent of the actual quality of your work.

>>7167995
when what you draw is shit, it means you're drawing too ambitiously, so you can reign it in and draw things that are easier, while pushing yourself once in a while. There is nothing wrong with drawing anime girls in voids until you're ready to move on.

>>7164921
>just practice for 5 years
You just need a few months, 1 year to see if you have aptitude.

Before and After (Chyan and Mogoon Coloso Classes).png

>>7164925
>It's the same with bodybuilding, marathon runners, health junkies
It's not, those benefit you long term, specially old people. Drawing is ultimately useless.

>>7167760
>try animating then
>NTA
Animation is even worse and less fun, specially trad 2d which is boring as fuck.


Your embarassing art secrets

I'll go first, everytime I draw, I'm turned on by it, the strokes of my pencil hitting the soft paper like scratchy noise while I see the negative shapes in my drawing... I cant help but. Just feel so. hot. I tend to hyperveliate and lick my lips and say "Just like that babe?" softly I do keys to drawing, and did project 3b, I dont care about gender. I look up male model and cant help but notice his hips.

This also occurs with soccer too.

[spoiler] I should mention I was molested by a woman when i was 12.[/spoiler]

I'm a hikkikomori neet with no propects for the future or plan of attack. I draw every day, but an art career drifts further and further away from me. I think I will be kicked out and become homeless soon. Yet, all I can bring myself to do is refresh /ic/ 3000 times a day. What is wrong with me?

>>7165228
Learn how to cook. That will keep the house you are in happy, plus save them money/time. You can still be useful in the house hold. Fuck, even just keeping the house clean without being asked will make people happy. Be of use so they dont kick you out and continue the art grind.

>>7165331
we're all digital souls trapped in a digital world.

that said, no it isn't ai

>>7165354
it is, and ive seen the faggot who made it on social media dmca people reposting it

>>7165355
can you link his social / the post where people are saying it's ai?

>>7165357
https://twitter.com/8co28/status/16<wbr>83823765690683393
art for money will be dead or overran by faggots like this in 5 years since no one cares about exploitation until it happens to them. pick up a trade that you can still freelance.

>>7165358
oh fug

oh fuck...

I'm deleting that picture.

Is this some artist who is feeding his line drawings into stable diffusion? I had no idea AI could do perspective scenes with storytelling poses like this already

>>7165331
I could've sworn I've see that drawing on pinterest like years before the ai craze though

>>7165368
Not sure if it's the same guy you're thinking of but yes he feeds drawings into AI. To his credit he's one of the few people doing actually interesting things with AI though. Has a lot of good images.

>>7165208
I often imagine the characters I'm drawing sitting next to me to motivate me to draw. Like they're watching me and commenting as they would in-universe.
I always work better when there's someone next to me...
>>7165355
>>7165973
Vile faggot.

>>7166013
>I always work better when there's someone next to me
for me it's the opposite
i hate being watched while i draw so much that i leave the room if someone tries to sit next to me/watch what i'm drawing

I'm an ex-proompter. Keeping up with models, updating the software, messing with "nodes" and praying it makes the image 2% better, re-tagging datasets every time the most popular model changes, it all begs the question why not just draw. If AI art hadn't happened I'd probably still be playing video games until my wrists creaked
I did a xerox of my waifu and I already like it more than the slop because it's 100% on-model
>>7166013
>5 hour igor
literally me
fwiw my "studies" are going from days of on and off penciling to just one evening

>>7166069
very nice, anon. People get too intimidated by drawing, but once you find an effective learning method, not only does your art improve rapidly, you find joy in the actual process of studying.

>>7165208
i never study irl subjects, its always 3d models. I wish i could go to live drawing sessions but there's no such thing in my 3rd world shithole country :/

I don't like looking people in the eyes so I suck at drawing faces and even more so eyes

>>7165208
>your embarassing art secrets
I post on /ic/

>>7165208
instead of talking and expressing my emotional problems to friends and family (aka real people, like normal people do), I express and process them through creating fictional characters and their stories (which are based on me and my experiences).
I'm too much of a pussy to open up to real people, which is why I do it through art instead. I tried therapy in the past but that shit is so whack and didn't help at all, I just break down crying and feel even worse afterward.

>>7165208
I fucking hate drawing digitally, digital lines feel so shit compared to trad and I only do them because I hate them so much and want to be great at them so they’re less fucking annoying

the only reason i draw is because i want to fuck my characters and no real man has ever been as awesome or manly as them so im in a fantasy relationship with them like a true schizo. this isnt all that unique though.

There's a bunch of old work of mine sitting on a booru and I can't stand how low quality it looks. It's literally years old, I've asked the booru staff to get rid of it but they haven't responded to me. <br>It's so fucking cringe. It's from when I was just learning how to draw digital so it's rough as hell. I regret uploading that shit their, considering that fans to just do that shit for you (I had no idea until years later)

>>7165228
same buddy let's be homeless together

>>7165228
Same except my government gives neetbux so i can keep doing this for the rest of my life.

All of my drawings are commissions just to build up fake interests.

>>7166791
this is what i assume for most commissions of fan art. who tf commissions fan art? nobody.

>>7165208
i ejaculate in my female colleague's water bottle that she left unattended for some time
watched her drink from that bottle right after twice

>>7166676
If it's viable, hiring prostitutes and strippers could be an option.

>>7165208
Please go into more detail of the time you were molested by an older lady when you were twelve
I promise that I won't masturbate


i would like to ask something at the cost of being called a retard<br>what exactly IS gesture drawing? i read about it, i looked at a few examples and then used a website that shows various pictures to do it myself, and picrel is one of the things that came out of it, very rough and ugly as i had to do it in 30 seconds, is this gesture drawing or just a scribble? i read that it is about the "flow" of the movement but i'm not quite sure how to represent such a thing

>>7165455
you should start gesture with single lines, not trying to draw full limbs/forms. Start by setting the head (sphere + jaw shape or w/e you use), then one long line along the spine depicting the overall shape of the model + 4 other lines for limbs. Add details after if it's longer than 30 seconds.
You want to capture the overall direction and proportion of the limbs, but you also want to pay attention to their flow/movement.
For example, in your photo that guy is probably exerting force with his legs to hold that pose, you want your drawing to reflect that. In yours, the legs look too relaxed and way lower, they should be coiled like a spring. If you look at his thigh and follow from the waist to the knee, you'll see it describes a curve (bulging towards his face), so I'd probably just draw a line like that. And from the knee to the feet, I'd follow the back of the calf, which is an opposite curve, exaggerating what it actually looks like, and maybe even drawing it closer to his butt than it is in the photo. This would really emphasize the pressure against the rock surface and give a sense of tension. You could do something similar for his arm, which is also clearly exerting force against the rock and helping push his upper torso forward, once again in your drawing such force is lacking, looks like he's lounging at the beach.

TLDR: focus less on what things should look like anatomically, and more on the movement/force/action, start with single lines showing or even exaggerating that, if you have time left after add meat onto those lines, while keeping the flow and direction you captured.

>>7165455
It's about conveying movement and three dimensional form without worrying too much about anatomy.
When you're more advanced you start injecting more proper anatomy while still maintaining said rhythms and forms

>>7165462
>opposite curve
I've seen how people sometimes draw half of a limb and it kind looks like a snake, is picrel something closer to what i should do? also is the rule of thumb to draw the longer half of the limb to achieve that effect?

>>7165493
or perhaps should i have drawn straight lines indicating the direction and then the curves on top of them?

>>7165493
nta, but when he says flow/single lines, its smth like what you would see in the olympics pictograms
honestly, shit is more relevant in sculptures, at least thats what i found myself focusing on more when engaging with the mystical "flow" in art
the Rio 2016 icon is just peak sculpture flow
those are more simplistic, but you should see similar stuff when you just google gesture drawing

well i would post a pic, but ofc its in the fucking gay ass webp and couldnt save it to a normal png or jps
just google images of "olympics pictograms"

>>7165455
My understanding is gestures are the basic feeling of movement/form/pose in a very quick simplified minimal lines. A gesture can be a single throughline which you use to construct a figure ontop of as a guideline.

>>7165455
Figure Drawing: Design and Invention by S. Michael Hampton

doing metric tons of them helps
remember to get some understanding of form under your belt too because you're drawing the flow of the figure in 3d space, not just lines
if you're not spending a good amount of time analyzing the figure before putting pencil to paper you're doing it wrong

>>7165507
Could start with something as simple as this, as long as you accurately get the FEELing of what the pose looks like. if that makes sense. Feel free to add on or correct

>>7165493
Yeah, that's more or less what I meant, just make sure that when you draw the limbs over it they retain the flow/curvature of the line, which you did relatively well except the lower part of the arm. But don't worry it's a common beginner mistake to stiffen your gestures as you add more details, just something you'll get better at after doing dozens/hundreds.
I'd recommend looking at art others made, you'll notice that even after adding all the details, they kept that dynamic gesture instead of being fully accurate with anatomy. Picrel for example, look at the lower leg, it's completely curved, and the other leg has that sort of "spring" shape I was explaining. They sacrificed some realism to keep dynamism and motion. Sometimes if the pose is right you can even make some of these curves longer, again looking at the lower leg, instead of it being 2 lines (upper lower), it's all a single swift motion. Hell, in this case, that same line can extend all the way up the back and to the head. This is the kind of stuff you aim to capture in gesture: movement, weight, strength. And when adding details over it, you want to keep that as much as possible.

>>7165505
>olympics pictograms
i looked them up and i think i get it a bit now, thanks
maybe if i find a statue irl i'll doodle something too
>>7165511
currently reading that
>>7165515
i try to draw at least 10-15 of those random images per day, sometimes i find myself stopping the timer because i take too long though
>>7165517
i can try, i like how it looks but it's a bit hard to see what's actually happening
>>7165540
i see, thank you

>>7165542
don't stop the timer since it's meant to hone your ability to see and think
i would say more than half of the drawing you do begins before you put pencil to paper
even if you're doing 30 second poses you're better off devoting more than half of that time to taking the pose in and planning the couple strokes you have time for since speed comes with experience
also do more life drawing instead, even if it's the gesture of a household pet or people walking outside

>>7165455
If you are asking this question you need to find a way less dark pic so you can actually see the body that you are drawing. You are not at a point where doing a gesture of a picture like that would be helpful.

>>7165455
Hampton on the topic of gesture

force dynamic life drawing for animators.jpg

>>7165922
drawing people while they are moving feels difficult but i will try
>>7165928
that pic was from a set of 1000+ images displayed at random from a website
line-of-action dot com under the figure drawing tab
>>7165950
thanks for the sources, i will look for the books as well, i think i'm slowly getting it

>>7166048
That's great, but I was talking about YOU in particular. YOU are not ready to use that picture for the simple fact that you asked this question.

In fact, I would highly recommend learning more about human anatomy and construction a little bit more before starting on gesture drawings. Learning both of those will make gesture drawings a little easier for you.

>>7166058
alright, it's fine if i do both at the same time though right?

>>7166067
nta but i would just go back and forth between gesture, simple forms/construction, and simple anatomy and how they work together, they all go hand in hand

>>7165455
gesture is the expression of the movement

>>7165542
Don't do timed drawings when you're new. Focus on economy of line rather than speed for now.

>>7165455
Gesture is the bones. It's not what the bones are, but what they're doing.
Rhythm is the muscle and skin. It's not what the muscle and skin are, but what they're doing.
What a body is doing is abstract, easy to remember, and can be drawn quickly. The body itself is detailed, difficult to remember, and cannot be drawn quickly.
If you still have trouble grasping it, google/youtube wire armature making for sculpting. That is a gesture.

>>7166825
rare simon post with text

is this an omen of the end to come?

>>7166161
alright, will do
i *think* i have a grasp on the basics of anatomy though, i've been drawing for a few years now but never formally studied anything before and i've drawn the mannequin-ish figure used to show proportions countless times
>>7166690
i'll keep that in mind, i've seen a video explaining line weight which is basically what i see in michael hampton's book and it said that thicker lines give the impression of mass and so comic book artists use thicker lines on biceps and other muscles but in the book the opposite is written, it says thick lines are used for angular and hard surfaces like bones, am i missing something?
also i figured i'd just download some images and try to gesture draw them instead of going on a timer, still not quite right but i feel like i'm getting there
>>7166825
thank you very much, that's really nice

It’s so funny how shitty you midwits are at explaining gesture honestly, it’s so fucking simple and intuitive but you crabs use fancy words to make it vague almost as if it was something inherently “artistic “and all about feeling rather than very logical and obvious…<br>Nice crabbing everyone. Unless you really can’t explain it better because you are actually midwits.

>>7167051
You're a bitch and you should post your work now

>>7167059
You are black and you should post hands now

>>7167067
Black and proud of it, whatcha gonna do about it cumskin

>>7165455
Do you mind sharing the reference?

>>7165455
https://youtu.be/aOtVUHgJqQk?si=kgF<wbr>Jf9CV0LPWG5y6

You kinda get what gesture is, but you don't know how. Try to follow this video, do it in 0.7 speed if you need it. And apply what you learn on your other gestures.

>>7167106
Not OP, but I've watched him do gestures before and I don't get it. He's just wiggling his pencil, drawing lines that make sense but which I can't see in the reference while rambling about feeling the form and other ethereal bullshit.

>>7167111
Honestly, I never really hear what he is saying, just watch what he draws, look at the reference and try to do it myself.

>drawing lines that make sense but which I can't see in the reference
That's because it's not a contour drawing, it's just the gesture. I think he does like to show the form with cross-contour lines, but it's not really important.

>>7167111
Don't think. Feel. Feel the force.

>>7167125
Oh no I don't mean literally see. I am aware that I don't need to draw a contour - only the movement, but I guess I'm so inexperienced (I've done maybe 60-70 gestures tops) I don't see these movements.
>>7167127
Got it, time to git gud.

>>7166825
O Teal-senpai, may my drawings be cute and my studies successful!

>>7166825
If you don’t mind me asking, is it still acceptable if I use gesture forms that try to approximate the width of the body, like Reilly? I’m not as comfortable using armature skeletons like that.

>>7167330
>is it still acceptable
You do whatever you like, as long as you know what you're doing and why you're doing it, so that you have a process that produces consistent results. If something works for you, there's no reason to brute force your way into another method. It's more important that you understand the qualities that make for a good figure drawing, the process be damned.

>>7166999
first thing I usually look for is pinch and stretch to exaggerate, and anything I can simplify into one big swooping line (bonus if it's a "counter shape" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WC8<wbr>49fT8xUk - the lady's legs in this pic make a good counter shape)

try to find better reference though, you want high-quality nudes, not small pictures of clothed people. It's worth shelling out 10-15 bucks here and there for a gumroad/artstation pose pack unless that's like a month's wages in your country or something (not trying to be insulting, I know global pricing can make a difference and I have no idea who's in what country)

notice how even though I pushed that pinch and stretch it ended up getting stiffened up in the final sketch, that's normal and that's why it's so important to exaggerate and push those contrasts as hard as you can - harder than you think you need to - in the early stages

>>7167464
thank you, it's not much money here but i won't have it until i get a job first
i don't feel like asking my parents for money for nude pics, they will think i'm a weirdo

>>7167559
nta bur sometimes theres thread of pose packs and they upload a lot you can download, keep an eye out for those

>>7167106
i'm not really sure what i'm doing anymore but it seems to be turning out okay