lit/21916142.txt

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--- 21916142
>At high school, Lenin fell in love with Latin. His headteacher had high hopes that he might become a philologist and Latin scholar. History willed otherwise, but Lenin’s passion for Latin, and taste for the classics, never left him. He read Virgil, Ovid, Horace and Juvenal in the original, as well as Roman senatorial orations. He devoured Goethe during his two decades in exile, reading and rereading Faust many times.

>Lenin put his knowledge of the classics to good use in the time leading up to the October revolution of 1917. In April of that year, he broke with Russian social-democratic orthodoxy and, in a set of radical theses, called for a socialist revolution in Russia. A number of his own close comrades denounced him. In a sharp riposte, Lenin quoted Mephistopheles from Goethe’s masterwork: “Theory, my friend, is grey, but green is the eternal tree of life.”

>Lenin knew better than most that classical Russian literature had always been infused with politics. Even the most “apolitical” of writers had found it difficult to conceal their contempt for the state of the country. Ivan Goncharov’s novel Oblomov was a case in point. Lenin loved this work.
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>>21916142 (OP)
Based. Any recommended biography?
--- 21916175
I didn’t really fall in love with literature until I was about 25. As is typical for an American, I didn’t read that much in high school or college. I find that awfully depressing to recall.
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>>21916165
Yes!
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What literary character is Lenin most like? 
Well meaning intellectual who desires to be a good king but ultimately fails and ruins everything. That’s his cycle.
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>>21916142 (OP)
chuds need to recognize that lenin was based
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>>21916220
He certainly was not. He was a “chud” himself
--- 21916280
When will such a based man come and fuck shit up again. Do they really come once every 200 years? Why is there such a lack of leaders today?
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>>21916280
>muh daddy abandoned me 
>I need new daddy to spank meeeee!
>why no dicktatorship to punish the bad people?
>why god, whyyyyy?
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>>21916248
Yes. He was buried to Wagner's Lohengrin Ouverture.
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>>21916142 (OP)
How come the media can openly praise Lenin and not Mussolini? Never mind, I already know.
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>>21916308
I would prefer a solar flare to destroy all electronics rather than a big daddy man, myself.
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>>21916142 (OP)
Wasn't his favorite novel What Is to Be Done? Imagine being so well read and your favorite novel is still a piece of slop with no literary merits just because it shills for your same ideas.
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>>21916337
Mussolini was a socialist but leftists will never claim him. It wouldn't be surprising tankies who have read fascist lit secretly admiring him.
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>>21916337
The most baffling one is how media can praise Lenin, but Mosley, who was a pacifist and never did anything too bad, is seen as the devil.
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>>21916337
Mussolini allied with Hitler and was cucked to implement Hitler's racial policies even though he didn't actually believe in them. Not a good look.
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>>21916359

His favorite book was actually Jack Londons "White Fang".
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>>21916405
Jack London in general is very popular in Russia.
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>>21916409

Thats because Russians are based.
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>>21916337
Stalin is still anathema. Trots have lib-washed Lenin.
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>>21916337
They hung him upside down. He sided with Hitler when he should have sided with Stalin. 
>>21916374
He sided with Hitler. There’s little light between them and Stalin, but he chose wrong when choosing fascism, not state socialism.
>>21916383
Siding with Hitler, Mosley would have liked to be appointed PM with the return of the abdicated king. It’s just politics. Instead of being the toady of the US they’d have been the toady of Nazi Germany.

>>21916417
Doesn’t matter. Imagine Mus allying with Stalin and fight the Germans. The US wouldn’t’ve invaded them, they’d get a section of Berlin maybe. Been a part of the Warsaw pact. Collapsed with the rest of the in the 90s
--- 21916528
>>21916280
There are two major mechanisms keeping radicals out of power in America. The first is that almost nobody under 30 wins office anymore because the largest voter bloc in the country has been over 50 and simply wouldn’t vote for them. That means the people who get into office are the people who’ve established themselves in professional careers, namely in law, business, education, and occasionally the military. These are good professionals that make good money and don’t see anything wrong the system. Most often they’re grifters or careerists or they want to play some sort of money-media game. The second mechanism is college because not only do all of these careers require college degrees but most government and military leadership positions require college degrees and at college of 3 things happens: 1) you either toe the institutional line and jump through academic hoops and you get rewarded with a career or 2) you don’t and you either don’t get a good career taking you out of the running for office or 3) you get filtered out entirely taking you out of the running for office. It used to be in America, that politicians were mostly military or lawyers. You didn’t need a degree to be a military officer and you didn’t even need a degree to practice law. America lost its stomach for military leaders, turned instead to the lawyers, the law schools wisely lobbied to control over the lawyering profession and now not only do you need a degree to be a lawyer, you need 2 and you need a degree to be a military officer and hold most government jobs, which are prohibited from running anyway thanks to the Hatch Act. So what you get is a giant cohort of successful middle to upper-middle professionals that basically are fine with the way things are and are just looking to advance themselves. All the while, church and state are separated by law and dissident groups are suppressed. Only recently has this started to change while the parties dip into bartender candidates, but none of them are the caliber of person you’d want in office. The real problem is there’s no way for competent young people to get in without proving themselves to be part of the party for a long time. The GOP openly talks about how it likes to run wealthy businessmen because they don’t want to shake things up too much and because they can find their own campaigns. Forget soldiers, forget civil servants, they think millionaires hedge fund managers should be Senators.
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>>21916337
Even if Fascist Italy didn’t ally with Germany and endorse racial doctrine, it was openly imperialist and wanted a warrior class, which is deeply offensive to liberals, progressives, communists, and leftists of all types.
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>>21916547
Still would have fit in with the Warsaw pact and been good neighbors with Yugoslavia.

Might have helped defeat Franco
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>>21916556
Imagine how Fascist Italy would be like in the 1960s...

It would be amazing.
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>>21916431
Mental retard take, thanks for the laugh. How's high school?

Italy allying with Hitler was based, the rest of Europe should have joined in and destroyed the commies and the other Jewish institutions. Then send them all to Israel and let them fend for themselves for once.
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>>21916822
Hitler should have allied with the USSR.
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>>21916835
The USSR should have allied with Hitler against Mussolini and Spain
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>>21916142 (OP)
This is common knowledge. Of course he quoted Goethe, Marxists were infatuated with him. It didn't need a thread, but the amount of seethe it generated did give me a sensible chuckle.
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>>21916852
The thread was a response to
>>21915857 →
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>>21916822
>you’re a dumb high schooler 
>Italy allying with Hitler was based
>jew conspiracy tard
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>>21916818
Nothing in Italy since 1900 has been amazing. How could one political system accentuating a decades old corruption problem change that?
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>>21916165
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>>21916861
Rather strange way to bicker
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>>21916835
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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>>21916870
>r3ddit 12 year old hasn't discovered /pol/ yet
I guess that's like grade 11/12
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>>21916887
>Nothing in Italy since 1900 has been amazing
1900s Italy has Croce and Gentile, two titans in philosophy. You have the poetry of the mature D'Annunzio, the young Marinetti. You have real living breathing warrior poets and philosophers in 20th century Italy. In terms of culture, pre WW2 was Italy's swan song.
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>>21916930
>Lenin was the greatest man, second only to Hitler, and that the difference between communism and the Hitler faith was very slight.
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>>21916431
>but he chose wrong when choosing fascism, not state socialism.
Up to his retarded idea to join the big bogaloo together with the german retard, things were running much smoother than in any socialist country ever.
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>>21916928
strange you would read it that way
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>>21916952
I'm talking about material conditions and achievement, not book club or philosophy contributions
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>>21916887
Up until joinint the EU things were going golden
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>>21916957
He laughs because he and Hitler are insane over Jews existing.

Now imagine Goebbels having Hitler killed after they annexed Austria.
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>>21916972
>muh fascism is bedder!
When do you move to China?
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>>21917005
I didn't say fascism is better than the current living standards in europe, I said it was better than all the shit socialists were up to during Mussolini's time.
His popularity was incredible, the job market was saved, nobody in the country was hungry. It was objectively running smootly.
The popularity got to his head and since it was a dictatorship if the one man in charge becomes retarded everything implodes, which is what happened.
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>>21916983
>I'm talking about material conditions
Yawn.
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>>21916930
He came close to align with Stalin. 

He even praised Staling for making a government out of the unorganized "rabbish slavic people".

It was Hess (you know the cross-dresser Nazi) who saw that Germany could not fight a war on 2 fronts and decided to fly over to Britain and explain this to Churchill himself. 

Hitler was mad and insane when this happened.

At the end, Hitler respected the English but politics drove him to insanity. 

Roosevelt was also pro-britain :"a yellow man's country will never be a white-man's one".

It was supposed to be Roosevelt-Churchill-Hitler-Mussolini and maybe Stalin.
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>>21916939
/pol/ is overrun with zoomers.
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>>21916983
The country was consistently in the top ten biggest economies in the world since after ww2, it produced physicists of the likes of Fermi and has several impressive engineering achievements.
The standards of living have been decreasing only recently but in the 70s the average italian was having much better success in his career than the average brit or frech guy.
I honestly don't know what you are talking about, you seem to be talking about a stereotype instead of actual facts.
To this day, it's the second manifacturer country of europe, not the EU, europe, including the UK, russia, etc.
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>>21916976
I think seeing communists and fascists as two factions which argue with one and other is pretty common nowadays
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>>21917017
>and since it was a dictatorship if the one man in charge becomes retarded everything implodes
Which is why centralized government of all kinds of a bankrupt ideal perpetuated by ass-hats. Yes. History is the tale of a series of ass-hats continually failing.
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>>21917119
It is historically different interpretations of communism.
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>>21917119
True, but I’m not a communist or arguing
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>>21917132
>of a
Is a
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>>21917037
Europe didn't have more than ten industrial powers at that point. I'm familiar with the pre-ww2 statistics and Italy lagged considerably. The issue of southern underdevelopment is racial and has plagued them throughout. Italian development under the fasces wasn't spectacular either if we take Kennedy's statistics for it. Not to mention small population and land damn it being to a second rank power at best.

I would love to live in Italy but another 30 years of Fascism wouldn't have done much for them.
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>>21917132
He is wrong and Mussolini was never a dictatorship. Banning parties and free press doesn't equal dictatorship. Mussolini had not only parliament but a king, and was voted out by the Fascists.
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>>21916793
Do you think maybe any /lit/ poster who isn’t a poster on /pol/ should be banned? Every time someone makes a political discussion to drop red pills there is a lot of seething and reporting
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>>21917152
The communist party of China also has a nominal electoral process
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>>21917160
it's like /his/, a pol-lite adjacent for people exposed to the ideas in a shallow sense and more concerned with the debate between ideologies rather than accepting the critiques are a bunch of lies
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>>21917146
>Europe didn't have more than ten industrial powers at that point. I'm familiar with the pre-ww2 statistics
But it has held that title AFTER ww2.
Italian GDP was higher than the UK for a couple of years in the 80s, and even before of after you can see the difference is minimal
You are being willfully asinine, you can easily look it up.
>Not to mention small population
Same as france
>and land damn it being to a second rank power at bes
The land is completely resourceless and useless for anything but farming and tourism, that's true. Add to that half the country is useless and you have the recipy for stagnation.
I'm not saying fascism would have changed anything, but your claim that a country that is still in the top ten economies in the world to this day didn't do anything for the last century is simply incorrect.
There are several sectors that can be considered amazing in a material sense in the last centuries of italian history, from food to textiles, to arms and car production and design.
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>>21916220
Lenin was based but the Soviet Union wasn't The Soviet Union failed in every one of its objectives, and ironically workers in the USSR had far less control over anything than they would have had in a hypothetical Liberally Democratic Russia, never mind the west.
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>>21917194
>ironically
This was all a part of Lenin’s plan, you boob!
One of the Soviet Unions objectives was to industrialize, and it did, and just in time to stamp out the nazi threat. Then they proceeded to pioneer space flight. Pretty impressive, and all the people’s doing, not their ruling class 
Lenin and Stalin were a shitheads. The people of Russia were based
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>>21916390
He gave speeches in the 20s about the inferiority of blacks and how he was concerned about the birthrates of the white race, they had anti racemixing laws in Libya and Ethiopia. That quote is about the unification of Italy. The other fascists were civnats and Mussolini toed the line in the 30s to avoid angering them, the racial laws reflected his actual position.
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>>21916220
Lenin was a chud and chuds do consider him "based". Le rich people bad.
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>>21917186
hah, you have to be Italian. Not many histories lead with top tenz of industrial powers as the keynote. I think the claim here we're discussing is how Amazing Fasces Italy after 30 years would have been. My assessment: Based on the past decades of mediocre GDP under Duce, not much
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>>21916177
My nigga
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>>21916142 (OP)
just imagine how the 20th century would have played out if lenin had made oblamovshchina the founding principle of the USSR
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>>21916390
>>21918139
[Evola] told me Mussolini had asked him to write a new racial theory in order to counter that of Rosenberg. It would be the "Fascist racism," different from "Nazi racism"… And thus that entire brilliant Evolian concept of the "race of the body," the "race of the soul" and the "race of the spirit" was born that he labelled with the antipathetic term of "traditional." Something churned within me when I heard this word, as if before the presence of an intellectual social climbing, a literary vulgarity. This concept has been taken by Evola from Guenon, attributing it to Aryan Hinduism that mentions other bodies distinct from the physical that could be components of man, because if they only exist potentially they are virtual, being developed through the practice of yoga. They are bodies that are astral, mental, spiritual, etc. Being German, Clauss, the creator of psycho-anthropology, never called his theory "traditional" or "traditionalist." He was married to a Semite, which explains his attitude towards biological racism that he tried to outflank with his psychic racism, his "race of the soul." The "traditionalist" Rene Guenon also ended his days converted to Semitic Mohammedanism… 

If the theory of Evola and Clauss on the races of soul and spirit can be accepted as a comfortable element of exposition, in the end they are not necessary, only complicating things, serving only to speak of racism among hybrid and mestizo people without hurting their feelings, since a mulatto or an Indian among us could always think that even though his body is coloured, his soul might not be. There is the suspicion that Evola has just invented everything to speak about race to the Southern Italians and Mussolini. Yet, although their pride remains standing, reality does not change. 
--M. Serrano
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>>21918139
So many of these are just mentions of this race that don't mention any kind of hostility towards jews, blacks, or other races.
There is a difference between not being coroblind and calling for genocide like some other dictators did....
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>>21916939
Go back
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>>21916175
I blame our culture. You're hemmed in until your youth and vigor is reduced to the "manhood" of a middle aged worker.
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>>21916308
Inbred Romanov hands typed this post.
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>>21916142 (OP)
Oh yes the Russian Revolution, that time when angry young men living in poverty got tired of being killed in a pointless war so they did a revolution only to live in poverty and get sent to pointless wars.
Classic. But at least women got rights and they lost the little male privileges they had left so it was worth it.
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>>21916280
>such a based man
>promises to pull the working class out of poverty
>promises to stop young men from being killed in the war
>does not solve the poverty issue, murders some propriety owners instead
>gets young men killed in a civil war
>destroys last male privileges via full women's suffrage
Extremely based, life got worse for the men who participated in the revolution.
JUST
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hmm
--- 21919640
When you join the revolution and kill your landlord so life can finally get better.
BUT LIFE GETS WORSE, such a classic Russian moment.
FUCK ME UP
FUCK ME UP SENPAI
CAN'T WAKE UP
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>>21916280
Maybe ask Germany to fund revolutionaries in Russia again
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>>21916374
Mussolini was brought to power by business interests to crush the working class and prevent socialism
he was a left wing journalist in a previous life, but he was also in the payroll of british intelligence and informing on his comrades
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>>21920584
Thank you for this.
Should have known better than to believe for a second some poltard take gave
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>>21920584
>fanfiction by his marxist political enemies
Kek
Also he was on the payroll during ww1 to say germany bad, you absolute utter fucking moron
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>>21920584
Nice propaganda
--- 21920756
Reminder that Lenin was a MAZZINIAN "INTERNATIONAL NATIONALIST"

>the recognition of the right of the nations oppressed by tsarism to free secession from Russia is absolutely obligatory for Social-Democracy in the interests of its democratic and socialist tasks.

>Victorious socialism must achieve complete democracy and, consequently, not only bring about the complete equality of nations, but also give effect to the right of oppressed nations to self-determination, i.e., the right to free political secession. Socialist Parties which fail to prove by all their activities now, as well as during the revolution and after its victory, that they will free the enslaved nations and establish relations with them on the basis of a free union and a free union is a lying phrase without right to secession—such parties would be committing treachery to socialism.

>Just as mankind can achieve the abolition of classes only by passing through the transition period of the dictatorship of the oppressed class, so mankind can achieve the inevitable merging of nations only by passing through the transition period of complete liberation of all the oppressed nations, i.e., their freedom to secede.

>The proletariat cannot but fight against the forcible retention of the oppressed nations within the boundaries of a given state, and this is exactly what the struggle for the right of self-determination means. The proletariat must demand the right of political secession for the colonies and for the nations that “its own” nation oppresses. Unless it does this, proletarian internationalism will remain a meaningless phrase; mutual confidence and class solidarity between the workers of the oppressing and oppressed nations will be impossible; the hypocrisy of the reformist and Kautskyan advocates of self-determination who maintain silence about the nations which are oppressed by “their” nation and forcibly retained within “their” state will remain unexposed.

>No democrat, let alone a socialist, will venture to deny the complete legitimacy of the Ukraine’s demands. And no democrat can deny the Ukraine’s right to freely secede from Russia. Only unqualified recognition of this right makes it possible to advocate a free union of the Ukrainians and the Great Russians, a voluntary association of the two peoples in one state. Only unqualified recognition of this right can actually break completely and irrevocably with the accursed tsarist past, when everything was done to bring about a mutual estrangement of the two peoples so close to each other in language, territory, character and history. Accursed tsarism made the Great Russians executioners of the Ukrainian people, and fomented in them a hatred for those who even forbade Ukrainian children to speak and study in their native tongue.
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>>21918665
actually what did he fucking mean by this
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>>21921600
That marxists and greedy jew bankers are one and the same and result in the same oppression on the proletariat
--- 21921739
>>21916142 (OP)
>100 years later
>people are still posting Communist propaganda
You're deeply stupid OP. 

Deeply, deeply, stupid.
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>>21916142 (OP)
Read his work and you will realize he was a low IQ, seething peasant idiot who had no proper understanding of literature.

>but Lenin’s passion for Latin, and taste for the classics, never left him. He read Virgil, Ovid, Horace and Juvenal in the original, as well as Roman senatorial orations. He devoured Goethe during his two decades in exile, reading and rereading Faust many times.
Is that supposed to be some kind of achievement by The Guardian standards? XD
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>>21916528
Good post
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>>21916142 (OP)
Lenin was a pseud and he didnt even know what he was doing, his politics in power were indecisive and failed to establish a status quo which lead to power struggles and Stalinist purges in the following decades. 
The only reason he got into power in the first place was because of German support and because he was more ruthless than Martov, he was really all muscle and no brain which is ironic considering how he saw himself. 
Also nothing he predicted came true, absolute hack and only trannies read him at this point which is a fate worse than death.